Controls.Fail

orion242

Actions on BacnetSpyder explained Spyder Upload Perform this action to upload application in the controller to the ControlProgram. If the application in the online controller matches with application in Control Program, invoking this Action does only a quick upload. In the case of quick upload, too...

orion242

Been a while, but I believe you can just discover the controller in the BCP bacnet driver. Then one of the actions is learn logic?

You should be able to dump what you learned back in a new controller.

orion242

There is really no good way to pull a program out of a "classic" spyder controller if that's what your asking. You don't say which controllers your working with, and HW has a wad of devices out there. If its lon/bacnet spyder, you can pull a program. Its going to plop every block in the pr...

orion242

That door opens to the inside of the unit. The threaded rod that is holding the door, runs through the two holes the door handles use to occupy. They bend the latches under the pressure and just rip the doors one way or the other. This little guy is prob smashed up on the inside of the door since it...

orion242

Classic rock bottom control job slapped in by a furnace jockeys.

Would have me wonder what the kitchen looks like. Maybe all the money they saved on mech side was put into the kitchen lol.

orion242

Yea. Something tells me the installing contractor asked a few questions and the control outfit said...That's what on our drawings and what we supplied. Use it.

orion242

Working on a site that many of the door handles on the AHUs are broken. Broken as in the unit at some point saw enough pressure, it simply destroys the door latches. This apparently happens often enough that there are buckets of new handles laying around. This unit must be a frequent flyer for broke...

orion242

Going through my camera roll, more pics got squirreled away in my personal WOS archive. Few more to share here. Wire nut sales wet dream. This is prior factory control removal. Got'r'done I guess. Thanks for the labels on the RIBs. Cut above! Wire nut sales wet dream.jpg VFD Replacements VFD Replace...

orion242

Working on a new site the last few weeks and its gained one of the worst maintained sites I have ever had to deal with. This is a point for point BMS replacement scope. Last two days I had a small VAV system to fire up. 6 VAVs with HW and a two heat/cool VAV RTU. Figure I would start with the VAVs t...

orion242

Maxburn wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 2:52 pmWe would have to trench the site to do it. Each zone valve is digitally addressed. The only wiring is a combination power & comm cable, 2 wire.

Oh FFS. Doesn't get any more miserable than that.

orion242

Feel your pain. It would be an extreme case to deal with them on any project at this point. I'll have a mile of cable pulled and sort out insane modbus nonsense before I will use their stuff. Even after bid day, its elimination at all cost. Facking miserable things have wasted countless hours of my ...

orion242

At this point, seems it would have been easier to just replace the irrigation system with BMS controllers.

This just reinforces my black list of any fieldserver product.

Is the customer paying you T&M to follow this rabbit hole to the other side of the planet?

orion242

Had a short power loss yesterday and some of the PZEM-016 meters I have went out for an extended lunch. Have ~20 of them now. 3-4 stopped responding. 24hrs later, most of those came back on their own. Seen this before when power down installing additional units. Something is a bit flaky with them re...

orion242

Niagara device setup under the modbus driver. Note the byte order and use preset multiple register settings between them. Some do not support the modbus function codes for multi register read/write. The PZEM-016 only supports 9600-8-1-n. PAC5000 PAC5000 Device Setup.png EM115-MOD EM115-MOD Device Se...

orion242

Putting up a placeholder for a review of these dirty cheap power meters. To be clear, doubt any of these are UL listed and I wouldn't think about using them on a commercial site. These are for my personal use and one of my requirements was a protocol I can pull into my test bench. So communicating, ...

orion242

So what is chipkin saying on this?

I wouldn't use any fieldserver product anymore even if it was the last thing on the planet. Their junk has wasted countless hours, its blacklisted in my book.

orion242

Webinars are seem to be a dime a dozen these days. This set was pretty good and see they recorded a prior version of it. Good info for techs getting in to lab work. https://buckleyonline.com/training/session-1-antec-controls-precision-airflow-control-devices/ https://buckleyonline.com/training/sessi...

orion242

I'm still thinking the network components are cheaper due to scaling, certainly availability would be better volume too. ARCnet is probably the worst of all of them in cost and availability. Just a quick peek at that datasheet, the MAC is internal and it has several interface options to the PHY. Yo...

orion242

Well I was in the belly of the beast again this week. Not mentioning the OEM, but its one of the biggies. The initial meet up with their reps and talking general work things, supply chain crap comes up. The head guy says anything IP is a current problem for them. Thinking to myself, yeah whatever. P...

orion242

On these small routers I'm dealing with I've noticed that a lot of them skip right over having individual ethernet chips; they go straight to having a network switch on die. And it still needs external magnetics and the RG45 jack(s) at a very minimum external. On BMS modules I haven't looked into i...

orion242

At this point the components for IP are probably cheaper than serial network hardware (production scale) Highly doubt it. ARCnet, duh. 485, not a chance. Keep in mind even if a processor support IP directly it still needs external hardware. I very much prefer the bandwidth and troubleshooting tools...

orion242

Gonna be a real headache with owner supplied network. Been fighting that hassle on a few jobs lately. IT switches are on back order and not coming any time soon, but we need to be ready for Cx long before. Ended up pushing an extra through to pull our own temp network, but its not an all IP system s...

orion242

Kinda nuts that was the last meeting. Will have to reach out and see if this is dead or what.

orion242

Do a bit of work for small OEMs and their controls. Would say, it does take a bit of thought and planning to put together a nice package that can get dropped anywhere on the planet and not require a bunch of hassle in the field. Not only day one, but years later when heaven forbid they want to chang...

orion242

Sold pallets of crap to these third parties joints in the past. Only worth the hassle if its a package deal, aka some of its gold but its all or nothing when it comes to reclaimed garbage. They know whats gold, not us when a site is stripped. If we bothered to bring everything back, I'm not filling ...

orion242

Sounds pretty good then. Most OEMs don't bother with repair period.

I'm sure the third party folks will jump on it after ALC calls it quits. At that point, one is really stretching things to infinity.

orion242

How is their repair service in general? Reasonable cost, turn around and fix most what's tossed at them?

orion242

Maxburn wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:55 amI think they might be seeing some traffic from something unrelated like an amateur DOS.

Doesn't add up to me. If that was the case, why bother during a low traffic time slot. Running in AWS as well.

It's a big site though and its not free to mitigate nonsense when it comes along.

orion242

Sounds like the smart solution to me. Nothing wrong with isolating and protecting the older stuff. It’s just interesting they are ignoring older, sometimes current, systems capabilities with some of these requirements. Can't say their choice didn't make sense. But when top command say thou shall do...

orion242

Maxburn wrote: ↑Thu Jun 03, 2021 11:33 amAnd just WTF is windows doing all the damn time?

Yeah that's going to add up in the cloud unchecked. Wouldn't say stripping windows down to the bare min is going to get easier with the feature bloated server versions either.

orion242

A year or two ago I had an RFP for modernization of a large VA hospital. It was very clear they wanted all Jaces and supervisors brought up to the latest supported version of Niagara. All the field devices where crap from the 90s with AX Jaces and a proprietary driver that was not supported in N4. W...

orion242

Its been down quite a bit between 5-6am EST lately. Been down this morning for at least an hour.

orion242

: easy.jpg (8.1 KiB) Viewed 121435 times

orion242

Both FG & FS the serial console is 3.3v @ 115,200 baud. FG the pinout is clearly marked in the solder mask. Its the same on the FS. FG-32 FG Serial Console.jpg FS-32 FS Serial Console.jpg These seem to drop you into a shell on the main CPU. There is a second CPU handling I/O on both, doesn't app...

orion242

older FG not the FS

orion242

black_syphilis wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 7:41 pmall FG have an unique root password

Didn't seem to be the case for the unit I had. For starters the serial console port drops you right into a shell with root access. No logon required. Would have to look at my notes, but pretty sure telnet was using one of the default creds.

orion242

If the hardware build is subpar, wouldn't expect the software side to be much better. There was an option on the FS after the firmware update to change the "OS password" which I would assume changes the root account. FG had telnet running, not sure if the FS does. Haven't had the time to p...

orion242

This seems to be the super cap on the FS32. HCAP-D 5R5 255-F.pdf Not a great choice for your typical hot BMS locations. Down south, even northern installed in a typical RTU electrical cabinet or steam plant? Huston we have a problem... Molded plastic enclosure, epoxy to seal the bottom, maybe better...

orion242

Only thing that jumps out to me is inux-3.4.39 is about 2013 vintage, Very old. This page suggests there might be 269 CVSS on it but I can't get it to display. https://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerability-list.php?vendor_id=33&product_id=47&version_id=160797&page=2&hasexp=0&opdos=0&...

orion242

Scored a FS-32 for a tear down. Looks to be a NIB unit from 2017. Uses pretty much the same HCCCap supercaps. The bigger has molded plastic outer covering now. It may contain its blood better when it fails. The smaller one looks identical. Will dig up the datasheets and post. The location of the big...

orion242

Two years? That's just garbage.

About to pull the trigger on a FS-32. Kinda a pricey for just a tear down though.

orion242

Also would look into DFARS. Timeline on that pushing forward and solarwinds is interesting. Somethings change, others seem to find ways to ignore.

orion242

To add to this, I'm simply not going to post any content I spend a fair bit of time and money there first if ever going forward. Still like the site and will check in on it if its still around. If its something I put a deal of effort in, it won't be there anymore.

orion242

Seen it and in most cases it seems very fragile imo.

Solarwinds seems to be pushing a few things forward.

orion242

My two pennies.. This is not the first they have heard of it regardless what they say. This kind of damage takes time typically and is not a old unit by BMS terms. Installed in a hot location brings this up much quicker with crap parts. Good spec stuff might last decades in the same conditions. I'm ...

orion242

Part 1 – First sniff After hearing about inputs failing on the EasyIO FG-32 as a common fault, I decided to take a peek for myself. Thanks to a member in the community, I secured a used unit with several bad inputs for a reasonable price. Got the unit a week later and cracking it open, the first fau...

orion242

Lol, not a whole lot at the moment. Would put it in the still working off the ground, but time and motivation are scare resources. If it starts to take off I'm sure we will find more time. Last time H went down a few of us decided maybe it was time to build something else that's not ran by a bunch o...

orion242

Yea, not getting windows updates these days seems like an extremely poor idea. Contractors are certainly getting files on the machines somehow. Just one thing slips through the whole thing could fall over. Will say that MS hasn't made it easy to get offline machines updated either. Been wrangling th...

orion242

https://www.bacnetusergroupne.com/

Meeting coming up next week.

orion242

Fun read. https://media.defense.gov/2020/Jul/23/2002462846/-1/-1/1/OT_ADVISORY-DUAL-OFFICIAL-20200722.PDF The ICS folks for months have been going on and on and on about non-network attacks on actual sensors. Can't get any real detail on this of course but it sure seem interesting. How does one exac...

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